Episode 4: The Crew

[00:00:04] Speaker A: In rowing, you'll often hear people say things like she stroked the quad or I'm bow, or it had to have been three seat. When you're new to the sport, it seriously sounds like gibberish. But there's a reason rowers name their seats with pride. Seats are numbered, starting with one at the bow, the front, then counting up to the stern, the back. Each of these seats plays a unique role in the crew. Therefore, when they identify themselves as their seat, they're effectively indicating to you their position on the team, much like a quarterback would in football or a center in basketball. Let's take an eight person crew as an example. Here you'll have seats 1, also known as bow, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 and 8, also known as stroke, and then of course, the cox. Yes, in rowing we will call it an eight person crew when there are actually nine people in the boat. To the dismay of all coxswains everywhere, the bow pair or seats one and two are the farthest from the cox. They're usually very technical rowers with excellent boat feel. The bow is narrow and sensitive to movement, meaning the bow pair can significantly impact how wobbly the boat is or is not in the water. The next four rowers see seats 3, 4, 5 and 6 are considered the engine room. Typically, these four are the largest, strongest rowers in the boat. The 3 and 4 pair are usually where newer, less technical rowers will be placed in the boat. Seats 5 and 6 are usually the powerhouses of the shell, the biggest and strongest rowers who can ensure they are taking the cadence from the stern pair without sacrificing their power or accelerating the stroke. The next rowers, seat seven and eight, are the stern pair. The seven seat is responsible for translating the rhythm, cadence and stroke rate that is set by the eight seat to the rest of the bo. The eight seat, called the stroke seat, in addition to setting the cadence, also plays a key role in communicating with the cox to allow for real time feedback and adjustment based on what's happening with the crew. It is ingrained in all rowers from day one. Follow your stroke seat as the single most important and basic rule in a rowing shell. This is a fundamental concept in rowing to establish the synchronicity of the crew. In rowing, like in life, we all have a role to play. Whether it's at work, in romantic relationships, friendships, families, the roles we play are one of the secret formulas of life. These roles can shift and morph, evolving with the humans playing them, or they can be firm and static, holding the individuals together through well established routines and bonds. But ultimately, when each person shows up fully in their role and the rhythm clicks into place, the energy generated in that shared connection transforms individual strengths into something far more powerful than anything they ever could have done alone. [00:02:49] Speaker B: Welcome back. I'm Alicia Cushman and this is the gather. So here we are. We're gathered for brunch on this lovely Sunday. Again, still fall. We may or may not have mimosas involved. I cannot confirm nor deny. So let's kick off today with an easy one. Let's talk about what seats our kids rode or we have rode and the stories behind those. Kim, we're in Declan Rowe. [00:03:14] Speaker C: All right. So, as I said, my son Declan rode with Wakefield Crew for about five years, since the summer before eighth grade. And what was interesting is that for his novice year, for sure, he rode all over the place. He was in a certain boat, out of the boat, in this seat, out of the seat. And I remember feeling super, super stressed about the fact that there seemed to be no stability to what position he was going to play, for instance, on this team. And I know we'll talk more about phrase, but this is where a phrase rose up in our family that my son said one day to get me off his back. He said, mom, I row where I row. Lay off, it doesn't matter. I row where I row. They will put me where they're going to put me. And my job is to row the best I can in that seat. And that was sort of like an aha moment when you, when your parent, your. The parent realizes, like, oh, their kid has some wisdom and maybe I need to back off. But so then throughout the course of his time on Wakefield Crew, he was mostly in seven seat, which he really liked because that's right behind the stroke seat. He felt like it was a very important position for him. But then in his junior year, he was moved up to stroke seat for our second varsity boat. And that was really, I think, a mental and possibly physical challenge for him because he had to switch sides. I mean, people talk about being biswepsual or whatever and rowing, but usually in sweep rowing, you get used to having one side and so switching from one side to the other and one seat to another can be a little bit challenging. So he had the challenge of moving from 7 to 8, but then to move into stroke seat, the sense of responsibility that he felt was kind of a head trip for him at first. He used to say to me that he didn't have to think when he was in any other seat in the boat. And that when he was in stroke, all of a sudden he had to think. He had to think about the ratio, the rate, listening to the cox, feeling what the rowers behind him were doing. And my son happens to have been a lifelong drummer percussionist and he's got incredible rhythm, which I always felt helped him in rowing. And so he could count and keep time extremely well. But sort of knowing when to make those subtle shifts in timing were a little bit challenging for him. So for my very brief and not illustrious rowing career, I was always in the bow. So I was either bow seat or two seat usually. How about anybody else? [00:05:30] Speaker D: Yeah, so my daughter what rode stroke seat and you know, she rode from eighth grade on like she, when she was a novice she got put in stroke seat and at Wakefield crew never really rode in any other part of the boat. Which is a very interesting thought too. You know, as you're going through that those years, that's what you learn and you don't. And as kind of the. In the back of the boat but leading the crew, you're not following, you know, you're, you're not, you're setting the rhythm, you're setting the pace. [00:05:58] Speaker B: You're. [00:05:59] Speaker D: And like to your point, Kim, you're thinking about the race the whole time. And that's what I think she felt like. She was always thinking and managing that communication with the cocks and translating that into the boat. But it also lends to that, like, okay, well what do the other rowers feel? How are the other rowers? And so when she was at her program at pbc, you know, she was sculling. And so she was in different parts of the boat sculling. And then when she was at rsr, she was in different seats. I can't, it's going to be terrible. But I don't remember what seats she's in, was it exactly. Sorry. But I know that she was in other seats when she was sweeping RSR and it gave her a very different perspective. And now, you know, she's a collegiate rower and she's actually learning to row on the other side. So her boats were always rigged port side for stroke and now she's learning to row a starboard in, you know, the bow of the boat, which, you know, she's never sat in before because it's just a different, you know, rowing starboard is a lot different than rowing poor. But I think it's, it's really interesting because that versatility comes into play. You know, you said, you know, being Bisexual, which I didn't even know was a word. [00:07:11] Speaker C: I don't know if it is. [00:07:13] Speaker B: It's a term our kids use, at least. [00:07:15] Speaker E: Yeah. [00:07:15] Speaker D: You know, it's like if you learn one thing, you don't know the others. And in order to be a versatile rower, you know, you either have to learn, you know, just to sweep on the other side or be in a different part of the boat to really know what every rower is feeling in that boat. [00:07:28] Speaker E: So, I mean, Will did mostly seven until the senior year. And so he was the one that was kind of translating. Well, he always explained it to me that he was basically translating the. What 8 was doing and to the other side of the boat and how you can. So you're kind of mirroring what they're doing. So that was an additional thing, but it didn't have the same kind of pressure. And so I think when he went up into. When he went into the stroke seat, he. He start to feel much more pressure about it. And kind of. How do I translate that? And I'm now responsible for knowing what the feel of the various rates are. And when they call. When the cox calls to move to a different one, he's got to know what that is. And so I think he felt a lot of pressure on that and responsibility on the boat, which is good for him, but I think also didn't always. I think you feel that pressure, and then there's just social dynamics that are still set off as a result of that. So not sure the leadership part of it was the thing that he really wanted. But, you know, he did his best and. [00:08:36] Speaker C: Yeah, did well. [00:08:37] Speaker B: And they did great. [00:08:38] Speaker A: They did great. [00:08:38] Speaker D: They did do good. Yeah. [00:08:39] Speaker B: So Danny sat right behind Will. [00:08:41] Speaker E: Danny did. [00:08:42] Speaker B: Sat behind Will in seven their senior year. [00:08:45] Speaker E: Yes. [00:08:46] Speaker B: So Danny has. I was trying to actually remember if he was ever not either in stern pair or bow pair. I don't actually remember him either being on anywhere in the middle of the boat, so. And people have said this about Danny, and they said this about when he was getting recruited, that he's a very technical rower. And in college they say he looks like Derek, but with better form, which is crazy. And so Danny has always been a really beautiful rower, technically. And so I think that's why he's usually either in the stern or the bow. He is now sitting in bow. He spent a lot of time actually in bow seat. And he really likes to say, everybody says the boat feels better when I'm in Belle, because he's really good at kind of setting the Boat. And as he was coming, actually coming down this at the Schuylkill this past weekend, I was like, that's Danny. I can tell it's Danny because of the. Just the way he moves his body to keep that boat kind of not wobbling. It's kind of cool to see Derek. And also, Danny has swept on both sides, but he is primarily starboard. He has had conversations about potentially switching, but he's starboard. And then Derek, I was also thinking, as I can't think of a seat he has not sat in, I actually don't think he's been in bow. I don't remember him ever being in Bao. [00:10:01] Speaker E: So strong. [00:10:02] Speaker B: He's so strong. But he's also really great at rhythm. So he rode stroke. When he was at HP with us rowing, he rode stroke. And so I just. As I was thinking about that, I was going back to our conversations earlier about the roles that they play. And the role they play also depends on the other people in the boat. Right? So Will was stroke, because that was what's right for the boys that were in that boat that year. Right. And I think it's the same with Derek, right? Where he sits depends on, you know, he's 6, 3, 200 pounds. Sometimes he's the biggest guy in the boat, sometimes he's the smallest guy in the boat. And currently he's, you know, one of the smaller guys in the boat. And so I think it just kind of depends on who, you know, the makeup of the individuals of the crew, which role they fit best in in comparison to each other. You know, I have rode only stroke and only port, so I'm really. I have really found it fascinating listening to you guys and your kids experiences at stroke because I do not find stroke to be. I find it much harder to follow. I find that to be more mentally challenging. Right. I sit down and I'm just focused on the rhythm of the boat and, like, listening to the cocks and it just sort of naturally clicks and it's like, oh, this is beautiful. I've got my rhythm. Let's just check out and go. Keep the rhythm, keep the pace. But then again, I'm also a master's rower, which is a very different experience than a high school rower. So I'd love to talk a little bit about that. Like, I wonder if it's the difference between me rowing in a club and not having that sort of intensity of the competition and the pressure to kind of win versus I just get to go. Go out and have fun rowing. I wonder if that's where some of it is. [00:11:40] Speaker D: Well, that reminds me of a conversation I had with Mira and she said to me, she goes, right before a race, I have. It has to be quiet. Like, I have to think about, you know, the first 500 meters, the body and then the finish. Because as she kind of said this as strokesy, I'm thinking about what I need to do to lead that boat, to set the rhythm, you know, to listen to the cocks. And it's. She's thinking about that even before she gets on the water. So she's not just stroking and enjoying her race down, but she's really thinking about how much power output in the beginning, knowing her crew and how much power they have throughout that body and then holding back enough to the end to get that sprint over the finish. So maybe it is different. Maybe it's like the competitive side versus, you know, the. The enjoyment, rowing side. And I can see that. And I think also to your point, like, if you. If you learned stroke, and I think this is something to marry too, when she started sitting in different parts of the boat. When you learn stroke, you're in stroke, like, you don't know any different and it clicks and it's your thing. But when you're. Then in other parts of the boat, you learn to follow and. And you can enter her in your same vein. It was challenging to learn to follow, you know, in that beginning in those first boats where she was put in a different seat other than stroke. So, you know, I can see that where what you're saying is the stroke. [00:13:08] Speaker E: Talking back to the cox. [00:13:09] Speaker B: Yeah, well, at least I do. And I think that. Yeah, because the. In stroke, you can feel what's happening in the boat. You can't see it, but you can feel it. Like, I can feel if somebody's early and you. Sometimes it's such an imperceptible thing. Like, even if you're just a split second early, I can feel it, but the cox can't see it. And so, like, I will communicate there's bad rush, you know, someone's early, and then the cox can make calls and adjust. I can also say, hey, the drive feels sluggish. And so they'll make calls to adjust the things that, like, I will communicate things that the cox can't see, and then the cox can change the strategy or make the calls or whatever. [00:13:44] Speaker D: When we were rowing together that one summer, I was strokesy and I. So when I was in rowing in college, just for the short period of time, I was never in Stroke seat. And I always thought, stroke, see? Oh, my God, that's so cool. Like, I would love to be stroke seat. Well, I got my opportunity to be strokesy when we were rowing together, the three of us, that summer. And to your point on rushing, you can feel it. And I said to the coxswain, I was like, I don't know what to do. Like, I. The boat is horrible. I can't. I can't change anything. And he said, just keep rowing. They have to follow you. And so to that point, you know, the stroke seat can really feel what those other rowers in the boat are doing. [00:14:21] Speaker B: For context, rushing is. We talked a lot about the synchronicity of rowers, where you really have to have every sort of inch of your body together. Right. And what sometimes happen is in a boat is that gets disconnected and the people in the bow are a little bit going, like they'll go up the slide a little bit faster than their stroke seat. And that creates a lot of momentum in the stern of the boat where the. The stroke will actually feel it in their legs because all of these people behind them are kind of pushing forward and the stroke kind of has to hold them back. So that's what we're talking about. When we're talking about rushing, I want. [00:14:51] Speaker E: To put a note because in the future, I want us to talk about, like, the strategy of a race. [00:14:56] Speaker C: Oh, yeah. [00:14:57] Speaker E: Because I didn't ever think much about that, but obviously that's true. But when I got to follow our boat the one time with Jim, and we were right on it, and then you could hear the cox calling and we're moving in, you just realize there's this whole executed strategy and the need to not rush so that you have the space at the end or the energy at the end. So I just. That'll be fun to talk about, for sure. [00:15:23] Speaker B: It is really interesting as I'm sitting here listening to us talk, because we have a little bit of the master's experience. We have a lot of sort of by osmosis, learning from our kids, but we haven't. None of us have really, like, raced hardcore at all. [00:15:37] Speaker C: No. [00:15:37] Speaker B: So most of our experience is either through the kids or just through our master drawing, which is very different. Right. But also all of. Everything we're talking about is very much 8 centric. [00:15:49] Speaker A: Right. [00:15:50] Speaker B: And we'll get into this in a later episode. But all of our kids have rowed in various. Really, all of the boat types that. [00:15:56] Speaker A: There are, except for, like, an OCD. [00:15:57] Speaker B: Which is sort of nuts. To see you're the 24, which is even more insane. But, you know, the roles in the boat still apply and the strategy and the roles change when the boat changes. Right. So Mira has stroked a quad, which is a boat of four people with two oars instead of one. A lot of our kids have rowed a single, which is one person, two oars. My boys do a lot of training in a pair, which is two people, one oar. And every boat, the roles are a little bit different. Right. So Derek this weekend was in a pair as his first race, and he. Because there's no coxswain in a pair, and you have to really balance your. [00:16:37] Speaker A: Power with the other person in the boat. [00:16:39] Speaker B: There's a very different roles and dynamics in that pair than there are in. [00:16:43] Speaker A: The eight, where you have a lot. [00:16:44] Speaker B: Of people and a lot of that momentum. [00:16:46] Speaker A: Right. [00:16:46] Speaker B: And so he was a little bit all of the river because the imbalance between the two of them, and then he's the one in the bow actually having to steer. So it is really fascinating how, like, the different boats have different strategies and different roles, and I think that's really a, like, metaphor for life. [00:17:02] Speaker C: Oh, yeah. [00:17:03] Speaker E: That's what Will always loved. He loved the steering part. [00:17:05] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:17:06] Speaker B: Oh, really? [00:17:06] Speaker E: Yeah, he loved the steering. [00:17:08] Speaker B: Oh, that's awesome. I didn't know that about Will. [00:17:10] Speaker E: Yeah. In the sculling boats. Yeah. So he would. That's always what he chose in the. In the head races. [00:17:16] Speaker D: Okay. So how do you steer in a sculling boat? [00:17:18] Speaker E: I have no idea. [00:17:20] Speaker B: I don't know that answer. I don't know that answer. I like. I think that I have heard there's, like, a little toe steering that you can steer with. [00:17:28] Speaker E: We might need to have a guest. [00:17:29] Speaker B: Yeah, I think that would be a really good idea. Yeah, I feel like we should have a guest to talk about. [00:17:35] Speaker E: That Sounds good. [00:17:35] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:17:36] Speaker B: But I do think that, like, the different roles in the boat and how that changes over time is such a cool, like, metaphor for everything we deal with in life. And, Kim, you have talked about the book that you're writing and the research you've done on the Howard crew team. [00:17:51] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:17:52] Speaker B: Did you, when you were talking to them, hear any stories where it's like, oh, that's kind of really cool about the kind of team dynamic and the roles they uniquely pay. Did you hear anything special about that crew? [00:18:03] Speaker C: I always asked the people that I interviewed what seat they were in. And that's what's so cool to me about rowing, is that especially if you locked in on a team, especially at a higher level like college or masters, but maybe even high school also. Some people row in their one seat, like we've talked about for years, and it really becomes part of their identity to be in that seat. And so for me, when I would find former Howard rowers to interview and talk to, which I've only found about a dozen, I guess I, I have a huge database of names. Sadly, lots of those rowers have already passed on. But I've probably found and actually had conversations with about a dozen of them. They all remember their seat. That tells me like where they rode in the boat is very important to them even decades later. And so I did get to meet a guy named Steve Magruder, who was stroke seat for the Howard varsity team and very proud of that position. But I wanted to tell you about a guy named Bernie Thoms. Bernie Thomas was 6 foot 4 and on the varsity boat was the biggest guy on the team. So he was in five seat. Five seat is dead middle of the boat. It is the center of what we call the engine room. One of the great triumphs of the short lived Howard crew team is that they rode in something called the Washington Regatta on the Potomac river in 1964. And a lot of big universities were there competing, like George Washington and American and others. Big, big, well established, you know, teams. And Howard University was putting their one single varsity boat in this race. So you have to picture that it's collegiate boys racing all white crews on the Potomac River. And here's Howard with their one black crew. So the race begins. They're all lined up at the top of the race. The race begins and they're all pulling hard as it can be. And here's Bernie in the engine room in five seat and he pulls so hard that his oar snaps in half. Oh my God. Like they are barely off the start and the oar just snaps, snaps in half and they come to a dead stop. And so they freak out, as you can imagine, immediately start like waving their arms and say our or Bork or broke. And thankfully, and maybe, I don't know, I haven't found any confirmation. I wonder whether there was any acknowledgment like we've got to let these boys race. This is historic. All black boat. But they stopped the race, which may not happen, but they, you know, it was at least not far enough. They pulled everybody back to the start and allowed the Howard team to get a new, get a new oar, gave it back to Bernie and they were like Pull hard, but don't pull that hard. And so I don't want to give away the ending, but I'm gonna go ahead and give away any. They shot out in front, and they never gave up their lead until the end of that race. And they won that race. They won the D.C. regatta, beating all white crews from established crew teams. And so it's a really triumphant moment. To me, it shows the power of the engine room, and especially, like, when you're giving in your all and you're in competition mode. This guy was big. His muscles. He's ready to pull that oar, and he just snapped it in half, and I think he got to keep it, too. [00:21:00] Speaker B: So that's amazing. [00:21:02] Speaker C: Yeah. Sadly, he passed away in 2022, but. [00:21:05] Speaker E: Yeah, I mean, hearing you talk about this and the idea that, you know, they all remember where they were in the boat, and I think that's been an experience of all of ours. I can't help but think of, like, how we think about teams and actually just the sense of how long it takes to figure out what role you play in the groups that you are a part of. Like, what are the strengths that you bring? And, I mean, it's a lifelong sort of pursuit to try to figure out, who am I. What are the strengths? Like, what strengths do I have enough confidence in to say, you know, what, in this team, you're gonna rely on me for this thing? Yes, and I'm gonna rely on other people who have strengths in other places and, you know, to sort of build up. You have millions of these personality tests and how you build effective team, and it's just reminding me of that where. And then. So it's almost makes some sense that in high school, you know, they start off trying to. They're. They're going in all these different seats, they're trying to figure out where's their role, but then also just that sense of depending on who else is around you, what you're relied on is going to be a little bit different. So, I mean, we didn't ask this one before, but there's a part of me that is curious, like, what. What do you see as the strength that you bring to the teams that you're a part of? [00:22:22] Speaker D: You know, it's really interesting you say that, because I was thinking about your story, Kim, and I'm not about to tell mine, because it doesn't even, like, come close to comparing. But when I was at Fordham and I rode for a very short period of time, but I was always, you know, four Seater, six seat. So. And then Ed, with your question here, like, what do you bring? [00:22:42] Speaker A: I do. [00:22:43] Speaker D: I always feel like I'm kind of like the engine. I'll like put the effort into it. Like, I will dig down and I will like push things forward. I'll get things done. I come from a large family. I have seven in my family. But I'm always the doer. Like, I'm gonna get it done. And I never even thought about it in terms of where I sat in the boat too. But it is kind of like that engine room, you know, it's like just digging in and getting things done. [00:23:10] Speaker C: How about you? [00:23:11] Speaker B: I don't know. I'm over here about to cry because I feel like I just had an epiphany as you asked this question. [00:23:16] Speaker E: Are you the leader? [00:23:18] Speaker B: Well, so it's really funny as we were talking about it because we were talking about stroke seed earlier and how much they need to trust the team behind them. And do you guys remember in one of the earlier episodes I was like, that's my personal head race is that I trust too much and I need to build up these defense mechanisms. And as I'm sitting here self reflecting, I really do think that's what I bring to the teams. And I think that I bring an absolute faith that you have this incredible capability that exists in you individually that gives people an open space to actually live up to their full potential. Unfortunately, that also gives the space for people to be real shitheads and, you know, take advantage. But I think that's the power that I bring to a team is like, I'm really going to give you wide open space to be the best version and really push you to be the best version. Because I have that connection, complete trust in you. Does that make sense? [00:24:05] Speaker D: Yeah, completely. [00:24:07] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:24:07] Speaker A: Yeah, that's me. [00:24:08] Speaker D: That's what I think. [00:24:09] Speaker E: I mean, I, I'm definitely someone who I've discovered and this is a strength and weakness, right, that I, I'm an. I like to think out of the box. I like to change systems. I like to question why. Why have we. Why are we doing it this way? Let's do it a different way. And you know, that was kind of clear when I came in as treasure. And I'm like adding all these like, systems, like all this kind of stuff that was just, let's do some different things and, and that's good. But then the, the kind of the consistent follow up, like, I need people around me who are then going to be the workhorses to like get it Done like, so I think I have some of those. I've come to just trust more in my. My ability to think out of the box or to trust the push for some change or to question things, but to also then know that it's not my strength to always follow through. [00:25:01] Speaker C: Well, I would say for me, I really like to be a cheerleader and I found that to be a role that I'm pretty good at. It's very personally important to me to work in teams that I feel personally connected and that it's a positive working environment. So when I was president of Wakefield Crew Boosters, I worked hard, I did a lot of things. I did all the volunteering along other people. I didn't want to just be kind of a figurehead president, but at the same time I did certainly see my role as one where instead of seeing conflict, I wanted to find places to repair and make things better. So I don't know if that translates into a position on a boat, but I really felt like. So I'm probably more the coach running along the grass like saying, you guys are awesome. Because I really wanted to make people feel empowered by feeling supported and having a friendly environment and a warm environment and maybe that's a mom role. I don't know what that is, but like, it's a very like, especially with sticky situations that would arise, I would always think, well, I could be, you know, hard assed and walk into the sticky situation, which we had plenty of. I mean, I dealt with tons of crap as crew president, but my going in proposition was like, I'm going to try and sweet talk this person into seeing my way versus yelling at them to see my way and like. And I felt like I could do better with diplomacy. So I guess maybe diplomacy and kindness and creating a situation where people feel warm fuzzies versus feeling antagonistic, I found that more empowering for seeing positive growth. So. [00:26:35] Speaker D: Well, and dare I make the connection to Bowsey? [00:26:37] Speaker C: Go ahead. [00:26:39] Speaker D: No, but like, and, and settings that like making sure that it's set. You, you are in that position. That's where you rode. But you were always navigating to make sure that that boat was. [00:26:51] Speaker C: Oh, that's great. [00:26:52] Speaker D: So I think about that. I mean, yeah, I think it does draw that connection. [00:26:56] Speaker C: Thank you. I never thought about it like that. [00:26:58] Speaker D: We opened up these podcasts talking about what rowing teaches our young people and I think in a discussion like this, you then they might be too young to see it at the time, but over the years and I mean I can draw back Decades to when I was rowing, that those things are lessons. And it's. It's not just, you know, rowing a boat on the water, but it's all these other lessons that they got from. What was your. Your family staying. [00:27:25] Speaker C: I row where I row. [00:27:26] Speaker D: Yeah, you row where you row. [00:27:28] Speaker A: But there's a real reason for that. [00:27:29] Speaker D: And that position in that boat and what it teaches people. [00:27:34] Speaker B: I also think what we just shared really highlights what we have all felt about our group of friends and how we uniquely sort of complement each other, which I think is just awesome. And I just love you guys so much for that. [00:27:48] Speaker C: I love you, too. [00:27:50] Speaker B: So, again, that was a little heavy. So I think it's time to have a little bit of fun trivia. [00:27:56] Speaker C: Oh, my gosh. [00:27:56] Speaker D: Okay, favorite part. [00:27:59] Speaker A: I love the trivia part. [00:27:59] Speaker C: I love trivia. Okay, I gotta pull it up here. This is a person. You're going to have to name the person. This former walk on to the Harvard rowing team had the best erg score of any recruit the team had seen in the previous 10 years. Although he eventually quit rowing in favor of wrestling, he later returned to the sport while in grad school. And then later in life, he calculated how the rowing times on Mars might equate to race times on Earth. Who is this? That was a long question. I can read it again if you wish. [00:28:34] Speaker E: Let's do that one more time. Well, I guess people can rewind it. [00:28:39] Speaker C: Okay. [00:28:40] Speaker E: Yeah, well. [00:28:42] Speaker D: And this is someone we know. [00:28:43] Speaker C: It's a famous person. [00:28:45] Speaker D: Oh, it's a famous person. [00:28:46] Speaker E: And what college was it? [00:28:47] Speaker D: Harvard. [00:28:47] Speaker C: I'll just read it again while you're thinking. I'll just read it. [00:28:50] Speaker D: And someone who is very smart because. Yeah, calculated physics and. [00:28:54] Speaker E: Well, I'm thinking Mark Zuckerberg. [00:28:56] Speaker C: No. Good guess. [00:28:58] Speaker E: He never graduated. Right. But he went to Harvard, didn't he? [00:29:01] Speaker D: Yeah, but he went back as a grad student, they said. [00:29:03] Speaker C: Oh, yeah. [00:29:03] Speaker E: Yeah. [00:29:04] Speaker C: Well, I didn't say what grad school they went back to. They went to a different grad school. They went back to the sport of rowing and grad school, but it was not at Harvard. [00:29:12] Speaker E: Yeah, that's where he created Facebook. The Facebook. [00:29:15] Speaker A: I think you might. You might be right. [00:29:17] Speaker E: Well, she's already said no. [00:29:18] Speaker C: No, it's not Mark Zuckerberg. Do you guys get, like, three guesses? [00:29:23] Speaker A: Where did. Did Elon Musk didn't go. [00:29:26] Speaker B: Where did Gates go? Oh, what about Jobs? Where does Steve Jobs go? [00:29:31] Speaker D: Yeah, he didn't graduate. [00:29:32] Speaker E: None of them went to college. [00:29:33] Speaker A: Dang it. [00:29:33] Speaker E: Funny. [00:29:34] Speaker C: Or graduated. I thought this was gonna be easier. [00:29:38] Speaker B: Oh, no. [00:29:39] Speaker D: I don't know. [00:29:41] Speaker E: Emma Watson. Wow. [00:29:45] Speaker C: I do not mean to stump you guys this bad. Should I go ahead and tell the answer? [00:29:48] Speaker D: No, I want to keep guessing. [00:29:49] Speaker C: Okay, keep guessing. Well, can you. [00:29:51] Speaker E: Is there a clue, like, I mean, like an industry or something like that? [00:29:54] Speaker C: Well, I. [00:29:55] Speaker B: Is he a tech giant? [00:29:57] Speaker C: No, he is not a tech giant. It is a he. So I would definitely focus on the fact that he calculated the race times on Mars versus Earth. [00:30:06] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:30:07] Speaker C: So think about astrophysics. [00:30:10] Speaker E: Oh, Neil DeGrasse Tyson. [00:30:11] Speaker C: Neil DeGrasse Tyson. [00:30:17] Speaker E: He's one of my favorites. I love Neil DeGrasse Tyson. [00:30:19] Speaker C: Neil deGrasse Tyson rode as an undergrad at Harvard, but then he had such a good Earth time that he felt unchallenged by the rowing team. So he switched to wrestling at his time as Harvard because he wasn't as good of a wrestler. So he felt like he would grow more. But then he went to the University of Texas for grad school, and I'm not sure what the nature must have been a club or something, but they allowed him to walk onto the club rowing team at Texas. And then he later he was doing all this calculation about different Olympic sports and how they might be translated on Mars. And what. He basically said that if you can just pretend that there's water on Mars, there's water on Mars. He doesn't believe that the actual race times would be that different, despite the differential in gravity, because it's an inertia. Non inertia. It's kind of like inertia. He said the force to make your boat start moving in a body of water, it would be very similar. So anyway, that's his calculation. I don't know whether it's true or not. [00:31:21] Speaker E: Well, so anyway, anyone's gonna have something be true, and that's awesome. [00:31:27] Speaker C: Okay. Well, you got there eventually. [00:31:29] Speaker B: I feel like that's a call for anybody listening to do their own calculations and see if they agree. [00:31:34] Speaker A: That's right. [00:31:35] Speaker C: That's true. [00:31:37] Speaker E: Well, that was a good question. [00:31:38] Speaker B: That was a super good question. So thank you all. Super fun. Don't hit pause. Roll to the next episode. [00:31:47] Speaker C: Thanks, guys. [00:31:48] Speaker A: Thanks. [00:31:48] Speaker D: Thanks, guys.